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Planned Start End Dates and Predecessor links


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Pramod Kankure (1111) | asked Jan 19 '11, 3:04 p.m.
retagged Jun 14 '13, 2:10 p.m. by Michael Prentice (622913)
I don't find a way to enter planned start date or planned date for a work item. When I open a work item in web client in edit mode the fields planned start and end dates are not editable. It says none there.

Also,
I could create a dependency link between two tasks. However, same could not be accomplished between two summary tasks or milestones. the "Create predecessor link" is grayed.

5 answers



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Ralph Schoon (63.1k33645) | answered Jan 20 '11, 3:34 a.m.
FORUM ADMINISTRATOR / FORUM MODERATOR / JAZZ DEVELOPER
Hi Pramod,

I tried to provide some information on how that works here: http://jazz.net/library/article/590.

All the dates are calculated. You can have an influence on the calculation using constraints such as finish no later than and by predecessor, successor dependencies.

The planned dates are initially set by creating a snapshot of the type planned. The proposed dates are set by creating a snapshot of type proposed. You can see these dates for instance in the Schedule Variance plan view/mode. You can not edit them since they are calculated.

You can only create predecessor/successor dependencies between top level work item types. Which are top level is set in the planning section of the process configuration>configuration data. When importing you need to make sure to map the plan items to the work item types accordingly.

For why the distingtion is made see also http://jazz.net/library/article/589 and http://jazz.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=14899.

Thanks,

Ralph

I don't find a way to enter planned start date or planned date for a work item. When I open a work item in web client in edit mode the fields planned start and end dates are not editable. It says none there.

Also,
I could create a dependency link between two tasks. However, same could not be accomplished between two summary tasks or milestones. the "Create predecessor link" is grayed.

Comments
Michael Prentice commented Jun 14 '13, 2:03 p.m.

Where can I find a best practices article on creating Planned/Proposed/Regular snapshots?


Should I only create Planned Snapshots at the start of a release? What if people make changes to their vacations or we change allocations across projects?

If we don't make a new Planned Snapshot after people make significant vacation changes, they end up having Planned start/end dates during their vacation and the whole schedule gets messed up. 

If we do create a new Planned Snapshot after these kinds of changes, then loose our previous data on how the project was tracking vs the plan (management is unhappy and confused by this).

I need detailed articles and/or slides that cover how to do this in depth when tracking 2-4 simultaneous projects with shared resources.


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Ethan Vogel (5142) | answered Apr 07 '11, 2:16 p.m.
Hello Ralph -

I have a couple of questions about what you wrote to Pramod, as I am facing similar problems. I am working with the Traditional Project Mgt template in RTC 3.0 ifix 1 (with a view toward eventually bring the project management features ino a heavily customized process template that we've been using for quite some time).

Regarding planned start and end dates: I took a snapshot and I do see them in the Schedule Variance view just like you said. BUT, if I open an individual work item, these dates still show as "none". Is there a way to actually get these dates, now that they've been calculated to show up in the work item editor?

Regarding your statement:
"You can only create predecessor/successor dependencies between top level work item types.":
This is not the behavior that I've observed. If I have two "Business Need" workitems (which is a top level wi) in the plan, and they don't have children, I can create a dependency between them. As soon as one of them has a child, I can't (but I can create dependencies between the children). I'm confused, to say the least.

My goal is to have this sort of structure:
Parent X
,,Child 1
,,Child 2
Parent Y
Child 1
Child 2
I would want Parent Y to depend on Parent X (much as I can do in MS Project). Seems the only way I can get this effect would be to, say, add dummy children to hang the dependecies off of.

Any insight would be appreciated. Once we can get this working, we can say goodbye to MS Project forever :)

Thanks,
Ethan

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João Condack (2612) | answered Jul 21 '11, 12:06 p.m.
That I could not achieve. I see planned dates on a Plan but at the work item editor view it does not sync. I've already checked that the WI is planned for the same interation of the plan I took the snapshot. Its a bug of 3.0?
best regards
Condack


Hi Ethan,

please consider to look into the article http://jazz.net/library/article/590 . Basically you create a snapshot of type planned and the proposed times should be set in the work items.

With respect to the dependencies, as far as I understand the predecessor dependencies are only available for top level work items. Your situation below actually in the first case does not conflict with the statement. Why you can't with the execution item children, I can't say. I haven't seen that. I am pretty sure it is as described in the Article.

Make sure to select the top level work item and then create the dependency on another top level work item. I had a hard time understanding the UI at first too. You could also filter the execution items to make sure you can't select a wrong work item. Or you could try different view modes. If that does really not help consider submitting a work item.

Thanks,

Ralph

Hello Ralph -

I have a couple of questions about what you wrote to Pramod, as I am facing similar problems. I am working with the Traditional Project Mgt template in RTC 3.0 ifix 1 (with a view toward eventually bring the project management features ino a heavily customized process template that we've been using for quite some time).

Regarding planned start and end dates: I took a snapshot and I do see them in the Schedule Variance view just like you said. BUT, if I open an individual work item, these dates still show as "none". Is there a way to actually get these dates, now that they've been calculated to show up in the work item editor?

Regarding your statement:
"You can only create predecessor/successor dependencies between top level work item types.":
This is not the behavior that I've observed. If I have two "Business Need" workitems (which is a top level wi) in the plan, and they don't have children, I can create a dependency between them. As soon as one of them has a child, I can't (but I can create dependencies between the children). I'm confused, to say the least.

My goal is to have this sort of structure:
Parent X
,,Child 1
,,Child 2
Parent Y
Child 1
Child 2
I would want Parent Y to depend on Parent X (much as I can do in MS Project). Seems the only way I can get this effect would be to, say, add dummy children to hang the dependecies off of.

Any insight would be appreciated. Once we can get this working, we can say goodbye to MS Project forever :)

Thanks,
Ethan

Comments
Michael Prentice commented Jun 14 '13, 2:07 p.m.

I have observed the same behavior in RTC 4.0.1. It makes Formal Project planning really sub-par, confusing, and labor intensive.


permanent link
Ralph Schoon (63.1k33645) | answered Apr 08 '11, 2:05 a.m.
FORUM ADMINISTRATOR / FORUM MODERATOR / JAZZ DEVELOPER
Hi Ethan,

please consider to look into the article http://jazz.net/library/article/590 . Basically you create a snapshot of type planned and the proposed times should be set in the work items.

With respect to the dependencies, as far as I understand the predecessor dependencies are only available for top level work items. Your situation below actually in the first case does not conflict with the statement. Why you can't with the execution item children, I can't say. I haven't seen that. I am pretty sure it is as described in the Article.

Make sure to select the top level work item and then create the dependency on another top level work item. I had a hard time understanding the UI at first too. You could also filter the execution items to make sure you can't select a wrong work item. Or you could try different view modes. If that does really not help consider submitting a work item.

Thanks,

Ralph

Hello Ralph -

I have a couple of questions about what you wrote to Pramod, as I am facing similar problems. I am working with the Traditional Project Mgt template in RTC 3.0 ifix 1 (with a view toward eventually bring the project management features ino a heavily customized process template that we've been using for quite some time).

Regarding planned start and end dates: I took a snapshot and I do see them in the Schedule Variance view just like you said. BUT, if I open an individual work item, these dates still show as "none". Is there a way to actually get these dates, now that they've been calculated to show up in the work item editor?

Regarding your statement:
"You can only create predecessor/successor dependencies between top level work item types.":
This is not the behavior that I've observed. If I have two "Business Need" workitems (which is a top level wi) in the plan, and they don't have children, I can create a dependency between them. As soon as one of them has a child, I can't (but I can create dependencies between the children). I'm confused, to say the least.

My goal is to have this sort of structure:
Parent X
,,Child 1
,,Child 2
Parent Y
Child 1
Child 2
I would want Parent Y to depend on Parent X (much as I can do in MS Project). Seems the only way I can get this effect would be to, say, add dummy children to hang the dependecies off of.

Any insight would be appreciated. Once we can get this working, we can say goodbye to MS Project forever :)

Thanks,
Ethan

Comments
Michael Prentice commented Jun 14 '13, 2:09 p.m.

I cannot see this behavior in RTC 4.0.1. We've created Planned and Proposed snapshots but there is no Planned Start Date or Planned End Date in the work items. It seems to only be accessible in the plan. This means that work item queries are useless for my developers to find their work for the week. Both the Eclipse and VS plugin are built around getting this information out of queries, but with our Formal Project this does not work.


permanent link
Chethna Shenoy (3644) | answered Apr 08 '11, 5:09 a.m.
JAZZ DEVELOPER
Hi Ethan,
If predecessor is created between parent & its children then this dependency will be invalid. However you can create predecessor/successor dependencies between two different parent work items. This will also hold good for business needs where you state you faced an issue.

Regards,
Chethna Shenoy

Hello Ralph -

I have a couple of questions about what you wrote to Pramod, as I am facing similar problems. I am working with the Traditional Project Mgt template in RTC 3.0 ifix 1

Regarding your statement:
"You can only create predecessor/successor dependencies between top level work item types.":
This is not the behavior that I've observed. If I have two "Business Need" workitems (which is a top level wi) in the plan, and they don't have children, I can create a dependency between them. As soon as one of them has a child, I can't (but I can create dependencies between the children). I'm confused, to say the least.

My goal is to have this sort of structure:
Parent X
,,Child 1
,,Child 2
Parent Y
Child 1
Child 2
I would want Parent Y to depend on Parent X (much as I can do in MS Project). Seems the only way I can get this effect would be to, say, add dummy children to hang the dependecies off of.

Any insight would be appreciated. Once we can get this working, we can say goodbye to MS Project forever :)

Thanks,
Ethan

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